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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID ee8d9ab7d6854c12b4a60c3db15536aa; Mon, 26 Feb 2024 02:33:44 +0000 (UTC) From: Mark Millard Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit List-Id: Maintenance of FreeBSD s integrated toolchain List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/freebsd-toolchain List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-freebsd-toolchain@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: freebsd-toolchain@freebsd.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.400.31\)) Subject: lang/gcc* built via --disable-bootstrap via using just-clang instead of a gcc* vs. armv7 and armv6 using --disable-bootstrap by default Message-Id: Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2024 18:33:33 -0800 Cc: Gerald Pfeifer , Lorenzo Salvadore To: Robert Clausecker , "dim@freebsd.org" , FreeBSD Toolchain X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.400.31) References: X-Spamd-Bar: --- X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; NEURAL_HAM_MEDIUM(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_LONG(-1.00)[-1.000]; NEURAL_HAM_SHORT(-1.00)[-0.999]; DMARC_POLICY_ALLOW(-0.50)[yahoo.com,reject]; R_SPF_ALLOW(-0.20)[+ptr:yahoo.com]; R_DKIM_ALLOW(-0.20)[yahoo.com:s=s2048]; MIME_GOOD(-0.10)[text/plain]; RCVD_TLS_LAST(0.00)[]; ARC_NA(0.00)[]; MIME_TRACE(0.00)[0:+]; TO_DN_SOME(0.00)[]; FREEMAIL_ENVFROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; TO_DN_EQ_ADDR_SOME(0.00)[]; DWL_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[yahoo.com:dkim]; FREEMAIL_FROM(0.00)[yahoo.com]; FROM_HAS_DN(0.00)[]; ASN(0.00)[asn:36647, ipnet:98.137.64.0/20, country:US]; RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE(0.00)[98.137.64.32:from]; TO_MATCH_ENVRCPT_SOME(0.00)[]; RCVD_COUNT_TWO(0.00)[2]; FROM_EQ_ENVFROM(0.00)[]; DKIM_TRACE(0.00)[yahoo.com:+]; MLMMJ_DEST(0.00)[freebsd-toolchain@freebsd.org]; APPLE_MAILER_COMMON(0.00)[]; MID_RHS_MATCH_FROM(0.00)[]; RCVD_VIA_SMTP_AUTH(0.00)[]; RWL_MAILSPIKE_POSSIBLE(0.00)[98.137.64.32:from]; RCPT_COUNT_FIVE(0.00)[5] X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4Tjl6g6rVQz431T I learned some about the technical criteria for use of --disable-bootstrap as part of an exchange for a submittal that I made. There are 2 quotes that are relevant. One explains a relationship not explicitly in the wording that is explicit about --disable-boostrap . The other is more general (and not explicit about command line options) but that the --disable-boostrap fits in. First QUOTE ( specific to --disable-boostrap ) This should not be done unless you are building with GCC itself. The reason is only the C, C++ front-ends are supposed to be able to compile with a (non-GCC) C++11 compiler. END QUOTE In other words: all other stages/parts are allowed to do things that clang/libc++ does not provide compatibility for. Turns out that internal name-poisoning to validate some gcc internal scope-of-use criteria are an example of the issue that can make libc++'s lack of design for the poisoning a problem. Such has been hit in new contexts in lang/gcc14-devel porting. It was also involved in the older a4831f4933d0 ( "lang/gcc12 lang/gcc12-devel lang/gcc13 lang/gcc13-devel lang/gcc14-devel: fix build without bootstrap" ). The above QUOTE can make it messy to determine if one has hit a front-end problem vs. not for making upstream bugzilla submittals. If not viewed by GCC as a front-end issue but from/for code from other stages/parts, support for changing things may be unlikely. In lang/gcc* terms, if STANDARD_BOOTSTRAP works, effectively the response to a submittal may be saying: "so use STANDARD_BOOTSTRAP". The following quote is from: https://gcc.gnu.org/install/prerequisites.html and so is explicitly official GCC material: Second QUOTE ( more general than --disable-boostrap ) To build all languages in a cross-compiler or other configuration where 3-stage bootstrap is not performed, you need to start with an existing GCC binary (version 4.8.3 or later) because source code for language frontends other than C might use GCC extensions. END QUOTE (There is a missing /C++ in the wording. Also, not wording explicitly inicating which option syntaxes have which implications.) One has to read into that that the name-poisoning imposition of scope-of-use design rules is an example of a GCC extension, one that libc++ does not follow (i.e., does not support). Various parts of the code make no claim to support a context that does not follow the design rule. (The front-end's code must not impose the design rule for its build.) In general, gcc producing gcc has to be involved for some stages in order to be supported and those stages can use the scope-of-rule rule imposed by name poisoning, as an example. Ultimately these may lead to the need to avoiding --disable-bootstrap ever being a default for some lang/gcc* examples. A contrinbuting issue is getting support from upstream. Another could be how complicated things get as gcc progresses. === Mark Millard marklmi at yahoo.com