From nobody Thu Oct 21 17:10:18 2021 X-Original-To: dev-commits-src-main@mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org Received: from mx1.freebsd.org (mx1.freebsd.org [IPv6:2610:1c1:1:606c::19:1]) by mlmmj.nyi.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51388180DB1A; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 17:10:24 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) Received: from cell.glebi.us (glebi.us [162.251.186.162]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256 client-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) client-digest SHA256) (Client CN "cell.glebi.us", Issuer "cell.glebi.us" (not verified)) by mx1.freebsd.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4HZvB75754z4l8d; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 17:10:23 +0000 (UTC) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) Received: from cell.glebi.us (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by cell.glebi.us (8.16.1/8.16.1) with ESMTPS id 19LHAIug010675 (version=TLSv1.3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 21 Oct 2021 10:10:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) Received: (from glebius@localhost) by cell.glebi.us (8.16.1/8.16.1/Submit) id 19LHAIVd010674; Thu, 21 Oct 2021 10:10:18 -0700 (PDT) (envelope-from glebius@freebsd.org) X-Authentication-Warning: cell.glebi.us: glebius set sender to glebius@freebsd.org using -f Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2021 10:10:18 -0700 From: Gleb Smirnoff To: Emmanuel Vadot Cc: Slawa Olhovchenkov , src-committers@freebsd.org, dev-commits-src-all@freebsd.org, dev-commits-src-main@freebsd.org Subject: Re: git: 225639e7db68 - main - vt: Disable bell by default Message-ID: References: <202110190738.19J7cFtw067994@gitrepo.freebsd.org> <20211019112132.GC80160@zxy.spb.ru> <20211019133700.77c0ca7ac488eb99df50551b@bidouilliste.com> <20211020095206.GA77338@zxy.spb.ru> <20211020134237.17596440e1fabda5d40f6985@bidouilliste.com> <20211021094000.58097dbece05fcd445aa3d87@bidouilliste.com> List-Id: Commit messages for the main branch of the src repository List-Archive: https://lists.freebsd.org/archives/dev-commits-src-main List-Help: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Sender: owner-dev-commits-src-main@freebsd.org X-BeenThere: dev-commits-src-main@freebsd.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20211021094000.58097dbece05fcd445aa3d87@bidouilliste.com> X-Rspamd-Queue-Id: 4HZvB75754z4l8d X-Spamd-Bar: ---- Authentication-Results: mx1.freebsd.org; none X-Spamd-Result: default: False [-4.00 / 15.00]; REPLY(-4.00)[] X-ThisMailContainsUnwantedMimeParts: N On Thu, Oct 21, 2021 at 09:40:00AM +0200, Emmanuel Vadot wrote: E> > E> sane default that most users agrees on in base FreeBSD. If you don't E> > E> agree with the defaults we have a way to change them. E> > E> > To me this looks like abuse of committer priveleges. I got commit bit, E> > so I can change the defaults. E> E> Oh common ... This is not the answer I'd like to hear. :( I'd rather hear why your opinion matters more than for example Slawa's. E> Except that FreeBSD doesn't include drm drivers or graphical env by E> default so the first thing that a user (new or not) have to deal with E> is vt(4). So they will login, do a bunch of command to configure the E> machine and will probably use tab for completion, and what will they E> hear when multiple commands are possible ? The bell. What will they E> hear if they try to go left or right in the shell and arrive at one of E> the ends ? The bell. And they will hear it in a bunch of other E> situation. So the problem is that we are forcing people to go through painful graphics setup, rather than in the bell. E> Again it's clearly user preference and as you can see I really hate E> this bell. I'm sure that more people than the one who answered this E> commit like the bell but the question is do more people wants it on be E> default or not ? E> The non-scientific method that is twitter seems to agree with me E> (https://twitter.com/FreeBSDHelp/status/1450955125002887170). E> So, do we really want to make a poll so users can vote on what to do E> with a freaking bell ??? Well, if you put it like that, I can compose a 100% symmetrical answer: As you see I really LOVE the bell. And I'm looking forward to upgrade my desktop past your commit and expecting my BELOVED bell to be turned off. Just like you, I hate idea of tweaking configuration, I want it ON by default as it used to be from the beginning of times. Unlike Slawa, I got commit bit, so I can go and turn it back on. So, yeah, looks like creating a poll about a precious bell could be a solution of this dispute. -- Gleb Smirnoff